In reading the article with the Botany Photo of the Day linked below, I ran accross this text: http://www.botanicalgarden.ubc.ca/potd/2005/06/acer_shirasawan.php Douglas--I was hoping you would commnet or give some validity to this idea beyond the characteristic that the lobes curl under to some degree. Similarly, I had made comments in the gallery under Acer plamatum 'Yasemin' that I feel its lineage is uncertain from a visual standpoint, in that it does not show strong characteristic of shirasawanum. Gomero then replied that on a recent visit with Cor Van Geldern he was told by Cor that 'Yasemin' had been reclassified into Shirasawanum. What this all leads to the qestion of what characteristic is causing those of Maple Society regard to put these trees into Shiraswaunum? I am mostly focusing on what I feel to be palmatum-like trees, but the same arguement applies for japonicums. Of this short list: Yasemin Gloria Red Dawn Acer x Sensu Acer x Johin Trompenburg (Green and Red) What makes them interspecific hybrids or proposed shirasawanums not japonicum or palmatum--do we really belive the interspecific hybrids to be legitmate and that Green Trompenburg is really a shirasawanum? Michael